Controlled vocabulary
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Dear all, I'm starting to get more serious about tagging/keywording my photos, One thing that I'm looking into a little more is proper keywording Anyway, it's an idea - and I'd like to know how to go about it. Please can anyone tell me: 1. Are there Controlled Vocabularies available and specifically for Digikam? I might envisage Digikam starting up the first time with a set of Is there anyone else generally interested in this, either specifically Obviously, I've used my friend Google - but can't seem to turn up Comments and help from other users would be very welcome. Many thanks, Mark. _______________________________________________ Digikam-users mailing list [hidden email] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users |
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On Tuesday 28 February 2012 16:52:23 Mark Hayes wrote:
> Dear all, > > I'm starting to get more serious about tagging/keywording my photos, > and that's why I'm trying to get set up with Digikam again. > > One thing that I'm looking into a little more is proper keywording > using a controlled vocabulary <...> Hmm, 4th question in less than 24 h, and no answers to a request for more information... Good luck. _______________________________________________ Digikam-users mailing list [hidden email] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users |
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In reply to this post by Mark Hayes (Hotmail)
Am 28.02.2012 09:52, schrieb Mark Hayes (Hotmail):
> Dear all, > > I'm starting to get more serious about tagging/keywording my photos, > and that's why I'm trying to get set up with Digikam again. > > One thing that I'm looking into a little more is proper keywording > using a controlled vocabulary (see > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_vocabulary) to make sure that > I use keywords that might help me sell photos at a later date (I > wish!!) - or at least allow me to find them more easily later on. The > point is that a controlled vocabulary would ensure that more people > use the correct/same terminology to define ideas and allow easier > searching at a later date. I understand that many picture libraries > and stock agencies prefer it. As already stated in the wikipedia article there are to many ways to define one thing and wording is not that specific. If it comes to nature photo it is easy, as all species have their specific name. But there are many things out there which have different word for the same thing (i.e. Karneval/Fasching in Germany) or use same words for different things (like football). And please keep in mind that there are many people out there speaking "only" native tongue. So we have different problems - which language to choose - how make the wording clear A clear terminology is a nice thing, but you have to learn them. It is easy for programming language as there is no other way to go. But I don't see any chance for photo tagging. I see no reason why I should use other tags than german. I can read English very well, but my son can't. Same is true for my mother any many other people around me. Next problem: what language shall be used for locations (country and city names). As long as the country/city starts with the same letter you can sort the data alphabetically and nay find it. But if you don't know the correct name searching is useless. To me the main problem is that there are specific terminology terms for different groups. In mathematic the complex part of a number is usually marked with an 'i' (sqrt(-1) = 0 + i1) but for all electronic engineers the little i marks the electric current so they use 'j' instead (at least in Germany). What is the right terminology to use? And the last part: what to do with all the photos not matching any controlled terminology? I use tags that fit my needs and may be useful for the people around me. But I must confess that I don't sell photos. Martin > > Anyway, it's an idea - and I'd like to know how to go about it. > > Please can anyone tell me: > > 1. Are there Controlled Vocabularies available and specifically for > Digikam? > 2. Is there a repository somewhere, where I can find Open Sourced > controlled vocabularies that could be imported into Digikam? > 3. What format would a tagging/keywording structure take in terms of > an import file? Supposing I could get a list somewhere - are there > tools I can find for turning these into the correct structure for > import to Digikam? > 4. Digikam's tag structure seems to be completely empty when opened > for first use - does anyone think that there should be an option for > using a 'standardised' simplified structure, or choice of tag > structures / vocabularies that could then be more easily populated by > the user (a starter tag-set to get people going)? > > I might envisage Digikam starting up the first time with a set of > pre-loaded Controlled Vocabulary libraries that you could choose from > if you wanted - from a generic simple starter-set through to more > complicated libraries that contain Flora and Fauna taxonomies etc etc. > Then you would just go into 'tags' or whatever and tick the boxes > next to each "tag library" to have them toggled on or off and placed > into your own tag structure. Or just create your own from scratch - > as it seems to be currently set up. Or even better, choose to toggle > on some more structured vocabulary library, but also then add in your > own tags as you want or need them. > > Is there anyone else generally interested in this, either specifically > for Digikam or generally in the Open Source world? > > Obviously, I've used my friend Google - but can't seem to turn up > anything quickly... > > Comments and help from other users would be very welcome. > > Many thanks, > > Mark. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Digikam-users mailing list > [hidden email] > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users _______________________________________________ Digikam-users mailing list [hidden email] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users |
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Hi Mark
If i understand your question correctly then Digikam does have a controlled vocabulary (ontology).for tags Go to "image" then "metadata" then "edit IPTC" then "subjects" then click the box that says "use structured definition of the subject matter" then click on the dropdown list box to select the IPTC reference code that suits and click "apply" This IPTC system is used by news organizations for images. Cheers JohnB On 28/02/12 19:44, Martin (KDE) wrote: > Am 28.02.2012 09:52, schrieb Mark Hayes (Hotmail): >> Dear all, >> >> I'm starting to get more serious about tagging/keywording my photos, >> and that's why I'm trying to get set up with Digikam again. >> >> One thing that I'm looking into a little more is proper keywording >> using a controlled vocabulary (see >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_vocabulary) to make sure that >> I use keywords that might help me sell photos at a later date (I >> wish!!) - or at least allow me to find them more easily later on. The >> point is that a controlled vocabulary would ensure that more people >> use the correct/same terminology to define ideas and allow easier >> searching at a later date. I understand that many picture libraries >> and stock agencies prefer it. > As already stated in the wikipedia article there are to many ways to > define one thing and wording is not that specific. If it comes to nature > photo it is easy, as all species have their specific name. But there are > many things out there which have different word for the same thing (i.e. > Karneval/Fasching in Germany) or use same words for different things > (like football). And please keep in mind that there are many people out > there speaking "only" native tongue. > > So we have different problems > - which language to choose > - how make the wording clear > > A clear terminology is a nice thing, but you have to learn them. It is > easy for programming language as there is no other way to go. But I > don't see any chance for photo tagging. I see no reason why I should use > other tags than german. I can read English very well, but my son can't. > Same is true for my mother any many other people around me. > > Next problem: what language shall be used for locations (country and > city names). As long as the country/city starts with the same letter you > can sort the data alphabetically and nay find it. But if you don't know > the correct name searching is useless. > > To me the main problem is that there are specific terminology terms for > different groups. In mathematic the complex part of a number is usually > marked with an 'i' (sqrt(-1) = 0 + i1) but for all electronic engineers > the little i marks the electric current so they use 'j' instead (at > least in Germany). What is the right terminology to use? > > And the last part: what to do with all the photos not matching any > controlled terminology? > > I use tags that fit my needs and may be useful for the people around me. > But I must confess that I don't sell photos. > > Martin > >> Anyway, it's an idea - and I'd like to know how to go about it. >> >> Please can anyone tell me: >> >> 1. Are there Controlled Vocabularies available and specifically for >> Digikam? >> 2. Is there a repository somewhere, where I can find Open Sourced >> controlled vocabularies that could be imported into Digikam? >> 3. What format would a tagging/keywording structure take in terms of >> an import file? Supposing I could get a list somewhere - are there >> tools I can find for turning these into the correct structure for >> import to Digikam? >> 4. Digikam's tag structure seems to be completely empty when opened >> for first use - does anyone think that there should be an option for >> using a 'standardised' simplified structure, or choice of tag >> structures / vocabularies that could then be more easily populated by >> the user (a starter tag-set to get people going)? >> >> I might envisage Digikam starting up the first time with a set of >> pre-loaded Controlled Vocabulary libraries that you could choose from >> if you wanted - from a generic simple starter-set through to more >> complicated libraries that contain Flora and Fauna taxonomies etc etc. >> Then you would just go into 'tags' or whatever and tick the boxes >> next to each "tag library" to have them toggled on or off and placed >> into your own tag structure. Or just create your own from scratch - >> as it seems to be currently set up. Or even better, choose to toggle >> on some more structured vocabulary library, but also then add in your >> own tags as you want or need them. >> >> Is there anyone else generally interested in this, either specifically >> for Digikam or generally in the Open Source world? >> >> Obviously, I've used my friend Google - but can't seem to turn up >> anything quickly... >> >> Comments and help from other users would be very welcome. >> >> Many thanks, >> >> Mark. >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Digikam-users mailing list >> [hidden email] >> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users > _______________________________________________ > Digikam-users mailing list > [hidden email] > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users > > Digikam-users mailing list [hidden email] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users |
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On 28/02/12 13:54, John Bestevaar wrote:
> This IPTC system is used by news organizations for images. Info here: http://www.iptc.org/site/NewsCodes/ -- John Stumbles http://stumbles.org.uk :-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-:-: _______________________________________________ Digikam-users mailing list [hidden email] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users |
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In reply to this post by Mark Hayes (Hotmail)
On Tuesday, February 28, 2012 04:52:23 PM Mark Hayes wrote:
> ... > One thing that I'm looking into a little more is proper keywording > using a controlled vocabulary (see > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_vocabulary) to make sure that > I use keywords that might help me sell photos at a later date (I > wish!!) - or at least allow me to find them more easily later on. The > ... Once upon a time, in my day job, I needed to know about ontology, which can be another name for "controlled vocabulary". It's a fascinating subject. Clay Shirky has a very interesting essay, "Ontology is Overrated" (http://www.shirky.com/writings/ontology_overrated.html) that is required reading for anyone interested in tagging and ontology. Among the points of the essay: 1. a controlled vocabulary works for small communities of specialists. The U.S. Library of Congress Subject Headings and the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM IV) are two good examples. Yahoo tried to use a controlled vocabulary to index the web. It failed. 2. tagging is better when the corpus is large, when amateurs are involved, when the catalogers are naive, when there is no authority. If both you and your customers can use the IPTC system that John Bestevaar and John Stumbles wrote about, then do so. Otherwise, tag your photos as descriptively as you can and don't worry about false positives in tag searches. Your clients will find what they need. Best wishes, David Talmage _______________________________________________ Digikam-users mailing list [hidden email] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users |
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On Tue, 28 Feb 2012, Robert Zeller wrote: > I am using Enhance -> Local contrast in the DK editor with fairly good > results; I don't think that it is possible to implement exactly Nikon's > dD-Lightning because it is their proprietary knowledge. Right, using Local contrast (or playing with density curves) gives similar good results, but it's impossible to reproduce exactly the original effect, for technical reasons : Nikon's D-lightning technology is implemented at camera hardware level and consists of local electronic gain tweaking *before* the analog to digital conversion. Roughly, it works as if we were able to use different ISO settings for different parts of the image, e.g. ISO 100 for highlights, ISO 400 for mediumlights, ISO 1600 for lowlights. Thus, the detection can enhance dark parts of the image without enhancing (!!) the noise too much (D-lightning increases signal/noise ratio in dark areas). And unfortunately, this can't be achieved after image has been acquired with a fixed uniform gain and original scene photometry has been degraded. But, lucky of us, the visual difference between true D-lighting before ADC and D-lightning-like effects from post processing software, is subtle in most cases. (And for very difficult images, consider using HDR or hand working.) However, the reverse effect (un-D-lightning ?) is always possible with processing software, Local contrast et al. So my personal philosophy for Nikon owners, is to always have D-lightning set to ON on the camera and should one dislike the effect for such of such image, one can correct back to an « almost without D-lightning » result. Regards, Jean-François _______________________________________________ Digikam-users mailing list [hidden email] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users |
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In reply to this post by David Talmage-2
Hi Mark
I would say that David is right on the money with his comments. I have a similar problem to yours in that i am working on a collection of images of plants and ordering them by the international system of botanical names which is a controlled vocabulary called a taxonomy ( see wikispecies). The problem comes when non specialists like me want to ID a plant growing in my local area but i havent a clue what the botanical name of my plant is. So i TAG my images with descriptive words in plain english that have a LOOSE relationship with proper botanical descriptions that use a controlled vocab ( jargon ) and put the botanical descriptions into the xmp metadata of that image. Cheers John Bestervaar On 29/02/12 02:33, David Talmage wrote: > On Tuesday, February 28, 2012 04:52:23 PM Mark Hayes wrote: >> ... >> One thing that I'm looking into a little more is proper keywording >> using a controlled vocabulary (see >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_vocabulary) to make sure that >> I use keywords that might help me sell photos at a later date (I >> wish!!) - or at least allow me to find them more easily later on. The >> ... > Once upon a time, in my day job, I needed to know about ontology, which can be > another name for "controlled vocabulary". It's a fascinating subject. Clay > Shirky has a very interesting essay, "Ontology is Overrated" > (http://www.shirky.com/writings/ontology_overrated.html) that is required > reading for anyone interested in tagging and ontology. > > Among the points of the essay: > > 1. a controlled vocabulary works for small communities of specialists. The > U.S. Library of Congress Subject Headings and the Diagnostic and Statistical > Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM IV) are two good examples. Yahoo tried to use > a controlled vocabulary to index the web. It failed. > > 2. tagging is better when the corpus is large, when amateurs are involved, > when the catalogers are naive, when there is no authority. > > If both you and your customers can use the IPTC system that John Bestevaar and > John Stumbles wrote about, then do so. Otherwise, tag your photos as > descriptively as you can and don't worry about false positives in tag > searches. Your clients will find what they need. > > Best wishes, > > David Talmage > > _______________________________________________ > Digikam-users mailing list > [hidden email] > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users > > Digikam-users mailing list [hidden email] https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users |
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