[Bug 195050] New: Color management doesn't work in thumbnails and view mode

[Michal Thoma]

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=195050





--- Comment #17 from Michal Thoma <michal thoma cz>  2009-08-31 19:58:17 ---
It definitely works and makes using digikam even greater pleasure!

As I was looking at the thumbnails it seems to me, that these are color managed
all the time, even when the color management is turned off. Seems like Color
Management settings are ignored for thumbnails (though it works perfectly for
view mode).

Maybe there should also be menu switch under View tab (like it's in Editor) to
turn color management on or off. Although I don't need this really... Great job
anyway, thank you!

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[Marcel Wiesweg]

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--- Comment #18 from Marcel Wiesweg <marcel wiesweg gmx de>  2009-08-31 20:15:25 ---
Thumbnail cache is not cleared currently, probably you switched it off and had
still the color managed thumbnails from the cache. I did not expect this
setting to be changed all too often.

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[Michal Thoma]

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--- Comment #19 from Michal Thoma <michal thoma cz>  2009-08-31 20:25:17 ---
Oh, so images are stored in monitor color space in cache? This makes sense,
right.

I have one more request. Can we have color management in Slideshow module too?
It seems to be last part od digikam which is color management unaware...

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--- Comment #20 from Matti Rintala <bitti cs tut fi>  2009-09-01 09:27:36 ---
Created an attachment (id=36607)
 --> (http://bugs.kde.org/attachment.cgi?id=36607)
Output of exiftool for several different Nikon image files

Here are outputs of exiftool for several different Nikon image files:
d300-srgb.nef.txt: Nikon D300 sRGB raw from camera
d300-srgb.jpg.txt: Nikon D300 sRGB JPG from camera
d300-adobergb.nef.txt: Nikon D300 AdobeRGB raw from camera
d300-adobergb.jpg.txt: Nikon D300 AdobeRGB JPG from camera
d300-srgb-to-adobergb.nef.txt: Nikon D300 sRGB raw edited in Capture NX2,
stored as AdobeRGB raw
d300-srgb-to-adobergb.jpg.txt: Nikon D300 sRGB raw edited in Capture NX2,
stored as AdobeRGB JPG
d40-srgb.nef.txt: Nikon D40 sRGB raw from camera
d40-srgb.jpg.txt: Nikon D40 sRGB JPG from camera
d40-adobergb.nef.txt: Nikon D40 AdobeRGB raw from camera
d40-adobergb.jpg.txt: Nikon D40 AdobeRGB JPG from camera
d40-srgb-to-adobergb.nef.txt: Nikon D40 sRGB raw edited in Capture NX2, stored
as AdobeRGB raw
d40-srgb-to-adobergb.jpg.txt: Nikon D40 sRGB raw edited in Capture NX2, stored
as AdobeRGB JPG

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--- Comment #21 from Matti Rintala <bitti cs tut fi>  2009-09-01 09:39:55 ---
Here are come comments concerning the attacment I just created:

I'll send Marcel the actual image files for further study.

I took the same picture with Nikon D40 and D300 with several settings:
- Raw (nef) and jpg
- Camera set up to store image as sRGB and AdobeRGB
- I edited a raw image with Nikon Capture NX2 and stored it both as nef and jpg
with AdobeRGB as working space (NX2 embeds an ICC profile by default)

I compiled digikam from svn trunk and tried the files with it. Here are my
findings:

For jpg files, Digikam correctly recognised the jpg containing an ICC profile
(edited with Capture NX2). It also correctly recognised the exif color space
tag in the sRGB jpg. However, it did *not* recognise the AdobeRGB jpg, it gave
debug output: "No input profile: invalid Behavior flags 1048576". Looking at
exiftool output it seems that for AdobeRGB Nikon sets exif color space to
"Uncalibrated" and sets exif Interoperability Index to "R03 AdobeRGB".

For all raw files I got debug output: "No input profile: invalid Behavior flags
1048576". It seems that Digikam did not try to interpret exif color space or
interoperability index tags, nor did it recognise the embedded ICC profile in
raw file edited with Capture NX2.

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--- Comment #22 from Matti Rintala <bitti cs tut fi>  2009-09-01 17:08:53 ---
Just a small addition to my findings about Nikon's way to tag colour spaces
(this was something I didn't know before):

According to exiftool home page Nikon's practice of using exif Interoperability
Index to mark AdobeRGB colour space is correct:

http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/TagNames/EXIF.html

ColorSpace
1 = sRGB
2 = Adobe RGB
65535 = Uncalibrated
(the value of 2 is not standard EXIF. Instead, an Adobe RGB image is indicated
by "Uncalibrated" with an InteropIndex of "R03")

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[Milan Knizek]

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=195050





--- Comment #23 from Milan Knizek <knizek volny cz>  2009-09-01 19:36:45 ---
(In reply to comment #18)
> Thumbnail cache is not cleared currently, probably you switched it off and had
> still the color managed thumbnails from the cache. I did not expect this
> setting to be changed all too often.

Marcel: what is meant by "cache" - some temporary thing valid only while
digiKam is running or the images stored in thumbnail db?

My motivation: I have AdobeRGB display and use it for editing of the "better"
pictures. However, I do quite often use it only in the standard sRGB space,
since many applications, including the X Window managers, are still not
CM-aware and especially the red icons displayed in AdobeRGB make my eyes
sore...

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[Marcel Wiesweg]

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--- Comment #24 from Marcel Wiesweg <marcel wiesweg gmx de>  2009-09-01 20:10:51 ---
> some temporary thing valid only while digiKam is running

Just that. For thumbnails, we cache the pixmap ready to be drawn (loaded from
the thumb db, color managed and converted to pixmap). Pregenerated thumbnails
in the db are stored in sRGB.
Reduced size previews are cached as color managed images.
Full sized images are color managed after loading from the cache.

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--- Comment #25 from Matti Rintala <bitti cs tut fi>  2009-09-01 20:36:39 ---
Marcel,

If thumbnails have been generated before colour management was turned on, then
thumbnails in the db are in their original colour space, not sRGB, right? And
if colour management is then turned on, they are wrongly assumed to be in sRGB
and conversion to display profile produces wrong results? Or are thumbnails in
db always colour managed and in sRGB, even if colour management for preview is
turned off?

Is there a way to clear thumbnails from the db without completely rebuilding
it?
And should users be notified about this when they enable color management for
thumbnails?

For example, I'm thinking about AdobeRGB images (which look acceptable without
colour management with many wide gamut displays). If they end up in db in
AdobeRGB form (colour management off) and are then used as sRGB (colour
management turned on), they saturation is way too low.

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--- Comment #26 from  <kde2eran tromer org>  2009-09-01 21:25:05 ---
I'm running DigiKam on my laptop, hooked up to different monitors at different
times (monitor at home, monitor at office, laptop's LCD). Each monitor has a
different gamut and color calibration. I wouldn't want to have to flush the db
or thumbnail cache every time I switch monitors...

How expensive is it to keep thumbnails in the original colorspace, and convert
them on the fly as done for the full images?

(Right now I need to manually switch the colorspace, but work is under way to
have the X server's RandR extension report the monitor's color space, and
hopefully DigiKam will use this in the future for automatic switching.)

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[Milan Knizek]

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--- Comment #27 from Milan Knizek <knizek volny cz>  2009-09-02 13:45:06 ---
(In reply to comment #26)
I wouldn't want to have to flush the db
> or thumbnail cache every time I switch monitors...

As Marcel explained, it should be sufficient to restart digiKam to refresh the
colour managed pixmaps in the cache from thumbnails db.

> How expensive is it to keep thumbnails in the original colorspace, and convert
> them on the fly as done for the full images?

As discussed above, it seems to be okay to have thumbnails db in sRGB only and
create the cached thumbnails as colour managed pixmaps in the colour space of
the current monitor.

We would potentially loose some out of gamut colours, but for thumbnails, this
should not be a hot issue. (E.g. the original image is ProPhoto RGB, thumbnail
is sRGB, monitor is Adobe RGB - the colours of thumbnail would be colour
managed for AdobeRGB, but we would loose any colour outside sRGB gamut but
within ProPhoto RGB gamut.)

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[Marcel Wiesweg]

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=195050





--- Comment #28 from Marcel Wiesweg <marcel wiesweg gmx de>  2009-09-02 18:58:11 ---
Matti:

> If thumbnails have been generated before colour management was turned on, then
> thumbnails in the db are in their original colour space, not sRGB, right? And
> if colour management is then turned on, they are wrongly assumed to be in sRGB
> and conversion to display profile produces wrong results?

Yes, if they have been generated before 1.0-beta4 or if color management (the
main option) was turned off.


> Or are thumbnails in
> db always colour managed and in sRGB, even if colour management for preview is
> turned off?

From 1.0-beta4, they are always color managed and in sRGB if color management
is turned on, regardless of the settings for color managed view.

>
> Is there a way to clear thumbnails from the db without completely rebuilding
> it?

rm thumbnails-digikam.db

> And should users be notified about this when they enable color management for
> thumbnails?

If they enable color management, yes maybe...

kde2eran:

> I'm running DigiKam on my laptop, hooked up to different monitors at different
> times (monitor at home, monitor at office, laptop's LCD). Each monitor has a
> different gamut and color calibration. I wouldn't want to have to flush the db
> or thumbnail cache every time I switch monitors...

I will go and implement automatic cache flushing if the monitor profile
changes.

>
> How expensive is it to keep thumbnails in the original colorspace, and convert
> them on the fly as done for the full images?

Pretty unacceptably slow. As explained above, this is not needed. The only
complication not covered currently is if someone uses two screens at a time
with different profiles. I deliberately decided not to care for this at the
moment (it can work for the editor, but is of course not tested.)

> (Right now I need to manually switch the colorspace, but work is under way to
> have the X server's RandR extension report the monitor's color space, and
> hopefully DigiKam will use this in the future for automatic switching.)

Interesting. I am implementing #197817 but I dont know how to detect changes.
Worst case is you need to restart the application.

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[Marcel Wiesweg]

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--- Comment #29 from Marcel Wiesweg <marcel wiesweg gmx de>  2009-09-04 16:42:15 ---
SVN commit 1019823 by mwiesweg:

Clear image and thumbnail cache if relevant color-managed view options changed

CCBUG: 195050

 M  +19 -0     libs/threadimageio/loadingcache.cpp  
 M  +6 -0      libs/threadimageio/loadingcache.h  
 M  +16 -1     utilities/imageeditor/canvas/iccsettings.cpp  
 M  +1 -0      utilities/imageeditor/canvas/iccsettings.h  


WebSVN link: http://websvn.kde.org/?view=rev&revision=1019823

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--- Comment #30 from Marcel Wiesweg <marcel wiesweg gmx de>  2009-09-04 17:37:42 ---
SVN commit 1019840 by mwiesweg:

Interpret the Exif.Iop.InteroperabilityIndex and Exif.Nikon3.ColorSpace
for AdobeRGB images when main color space is set to uncalibrated.

BUG: 191113
CCBUG: 195050


 M  +17 -2     kexiv2image.cpp  


WebSVN link: http://websvn.kde.org/?view=rev&revision=1019840

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[Marcel Wiesweg]

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--- Comment #31 from Marcel Wiesweg <marcel wiesweg gmx de>  2009-09-04 18:10:33 ---
The AdobeRGB / JPEG issue should be settled.
The NEF issue is different:
1) It seems that the color space tags in the Exif Info of the NEF file apply to
the embedded preview, which has no exif information at all.
2) The NX2 edited images RAW images have an actual embedded ICC profile in the
RAW file which also obviously applies to the embedded JPEG preview.

Is this NEF-specific? Does anyone know if other RAW formats also specify or
even embed color profiles for their embedded previews?

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[Gilles Caulier-4]

https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=195050





--- Comment #32 from Gilles Caulier <caulier gilles gmail com>  2009-09-04 18:18:57 ---
Marcel,

Look this Exif tags :

http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/TagNames/EXIF.html

0xa001     ColorSpace       int16u
0xc71a     PreviewColorSpace int32u!

And now Makernotes :

http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/TagNames/Nikon.html

0x001e     ColorSpace       int16u

http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/TagNames/Canon.html

0x00b4     ColorSpace       int16u

etc...

...welcome in this big puzzle...

Gilles

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--- Comment #33 from Matti Rintala <bitti cs tut fi>  2009-09-04 18:45:18 ---
Gilles,

I wouldn't be too worried about the Nikon and Canon specific colour space tags,
if Digikam only recognises sRGB and AdobeRGB using those tags. Since standard
EXIF specifies how those colour spaces are tagged using ColorSpace and
InteroperabilityIndex, Digikam can trust those tags. I think the
vendor-specific flags are there in case cameras start using colour spaces not
defined by normal EXIF.

It's interesting to notice that there's PreviewColorSpace tag as well! :-)
I would imagine it's safe to trust that for raw files ColorSpace and
PreviewColorSpace are equal, since raw files have no native standard colour
space.

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--- Comment #34 from Matti Rintala <bitti cs tut fi>  2009-09-04 18:47:58 ---
I forgot to add that it would be REALLY nice if libexiv2 would provide an API
function for returning an colour profile for an image (it could do all the
dirty work of reading appropriate tags and deciding which profile to use). :-)

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[Marcel Wiesweg]

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--- Comment #35 from Marcel Wiesweg <marcel wiesweg gmx de>  2009-09-04 19:42:47 ---
Gilles: We support the EXIF and Nikon color space already. The Canon tag
doesn't seem to be available from libexiv2 (looked in canonmn.cpp).

Matti: There is getImageColorWorkSpace()

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[Gilles Caulier-4]

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--- Comment #36 from Gilles Caulier <caulier gilles gmail com>  2009-09-04 20:09:46 ---
Take a care about JPEG embedded in RAW files and exif data. it's the hell.

To have experimented some problems with rotation tag from my Minolta camera, i
have discovered this puzzle : with dcraw, extracted jpeg embedded from raw has
exif data, but there are copied from raw part as well. There are not set by
camera in jpeg image data.

I checked in pass how dcraw work when jpeg is extracted : it sound like jpeg
image is extracted and after to be written to disk, RAW exif are copied to this
file as well.

There is a problem here : exif data cannot be exactly the same for both.

Alex can be precise here about this subject...

Gilles

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