IPTC: Person Shown / PersonInImage

[Jack Tummers]

Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I can see the
field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under preferences, but I
can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.

Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while :(.…



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[Gus Gustafson]

on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom icon on the vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging tool. Or, on the right hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th icon, then choose the Tags tab, and find or add the people section...

On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I can see the
field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under preferences, but I
can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.

Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while :(.…

Jack

---

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[Jack Tummers]

On the left there is nothing yet, because I haven't added any people so far.
On the right side I have this (but I don't see how I could add a people's section):

Op 08-04-13 20:29, Erik Felthauser schreef:

on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom icon on the vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging tool. Or, on the right hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th icon, then choose the Tags tab, and find or add the people section...

On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I can see the
field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under preferences, but I
can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.

Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while :(.…

Jack

---

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[Remco Viëtor]

On Monday 08 April 2013 13:29:05 Erik Felthauser wrote:
> on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom icon on the
> vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging tool. Or, on the right
> hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th icon, then choose the Tags tab,
> and find or add the people section...
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> >  Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I can see
the

> > field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under preferences, but I
> > can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.
> >
> > Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while :(.…
> >
> >
> > Jack
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Digikam-users mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
> >

Mr. Tummers is asking about a specific tag defined in the ITPC schema, that
can be displayed (as and XMP tag btw, see Configuration -> Metadata -> XMP
viewer -> ITPD extension schema), but not set under Digikam.

He asked the same question a week ago exactly (but from a different mail
address). And as far as I can tell, he'll be forced to stay with Lightroom
for a while longer...

Remco
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[Jack Tummers]

Yes, that's right. It's part of the IPTC Extension.
I'm sorry I asked this question twice. I thought something went wrong with the registration.

Link to screenshot: http://ompldr.org/vaTE3Ng

Op 08-04-13 21:13, Remco Viëtor schreef:

On Monday 08 April 2013 13:29:05 Erik Felthauser wrote:

on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom icon on the
vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging tool. Or, on the right
hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th icon, then choose the Tags tab,
and find or add the people section...


On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers [hidden email] wrote:

 Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I can see 

the

field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under preferences, but I
can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.

Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while :(.…


Jack


------------------------------




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Digikam-users mailing list
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Mr. Tummers is asking about a specific tag defined in the ITPC schema, that 
can be displayed (as and XMP tag btw, see Configuration -> Metadata -> XMP 
viewer -> ITPD extension schema), but not set under Digikam.

He asked the same question a week ago exactly (but from a different mail 
address). And as far as I can tell, he'll be forced to stay with Lightroom 
for a while longer...

Remco
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[Gus Gustafson]

right click, add sub-tag.

On Apr 10, 2013 3:42 AM, "Jack Tummers" <[hidden email]> wrote:

On the left there is nothing yet, because I haven't added any people so far.
On the right side I have this (but I don't see how I could add a people's section):

Op 08-04-13 20:29, Erik Felthauser schreef:

on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom icon on the vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging tool. Or, on the right hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th icon, then choose the Tags tab, and find or add the people section...

On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I can see the
field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under preferences, but I
can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.

Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while :(.…

Jack

---

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--
Met vriendelijke groet,

Jack Tummers

Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
www.jacktummers.nl
013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764

---

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[Jack Tummers]

Thanks, but I have no idea what you mean :(
'and find or add the people section...' Adding a people's section? How do I do that? And is that exactly the same as the IPTC Extension 'PersonInImage'?

Op 10-04-13 14:52, Erik Felthauser schreef:

right click, add sub-tag.

On Apr 10, 2013 3:42 AM, "Jack Tummers" <[hidden email]> wrote:

On the left there is nothing yet, because I haven't added any people so far.
On the right side I have this (but I don't see how I could add a people's section):

Op 08-04-13 20:29, Erik Felthauser schreef:

on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom icon on the vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging tool. Or, on the right hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th icon, then choose the Tags tab, and find or add the people section...

On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I can see the
field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under preferences, but I
can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.

Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while :(.…

Jack

---

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Digikam-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

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[hidden email]
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

--
Met vriendelijke groet,

Jack Tummers

Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
www.jacktummers.nl
013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764

---

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[Gus Gustafson]

As someone pointed out, I misunderstood your question.

On Apr 15, 2013 5:10 AM, "Jack Tummers" <[hidden email]> wrote:

Thanks, but I have no idea what you mean :(
'and find or add the people section...' Adding a people's section? How do I do that? And is that exactly the same as the IPTC Extension 'PersonInImage'?

Op 10-04-13 14:52, Erik Felthauser schreef:

right click, add sub-tag.

On Apr 10, 2013 3:42 AM, "Jack Tummers" <[hidden email]> wrote:

On the left there is nothing yet, because I haven't added any people so far.
On the right side I have this (but I don't see how I could add a people's section):

Op 08-04-13 20:29, Erik Felthauser schreef:

on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom icon on the vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging tool. Or, on the right hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th icon, then choose the Tags tab, and find or add the people section...

On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]> wrote:

Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I can see the
field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under preferences, but I
can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.

Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while :(.…

Jack

---

_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

--
Met vriendelijke groet,

Jack Tummers

Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
www.jacktummers.nl
013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764

---

_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

--
Met vriendelijke groet,

Jack Tummers

Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
www.jacktummers.nl
013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764

---

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[Simon Cropper-3]

Jack,

Your original request centred around the IPTC 'PersonInImage'. At
present DigiKam does not allow this IPTC tag to be changed, although
if the value is set using other tools you can see the value in the
metadata section of the right panel.

What Erik is describing is an alternative approach used by many on this
list -- the use of tags to flag who is in the picture.

Essentially you can create a tag for each unique entity and check these
tags if the person is seen in the picture (see manual on how to create
tags). These tags can also be easily used to filter your collection to
show, say all photos with your Mum in it.

If you are hung up on using the IPTC option you may wish to look at
exiv2 on linux or exiftools on Windows/Mac. These tools/libraries are
able to set this value. All you would need to do is set the value using
a script of sorts depending on your operating system.

exiv2 -- http://www.exiv2.org/
exiftools -- http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/

According to exiv2 manpage the value PersonInImage can be set using the
following command (I check this worked on Ubuntu)...

exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mr Periwinkle" image.jpg

You will need to check with the packages you normally use whether this
is going where you/they expect. When I inspect this image in digiKam the
inserted value is in the "IPTC Extension schema" where the standard says
it should be -- as stated although showing the value inserted I can not
edit the data with digiKam.

http://www.exiv2.org/manpage.html
http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptc.html
http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptcExt.html

I hope this helps.

On 12/04/13 18:35, Jack Tummers wrote:

> Thanks, but I have no idea what you mean :(
> 'and find or add the people section...' Adding a people's section? How
> do I do that? And is that exactly the same as the IPTC Extension
> 'PersonInImage'?
>
>
>
>
> Op 10-04-13 14:52, Erik Felthauser schreef:
>>
>> right click, add sub-tag.
>>
>> On Apr 10, 2013 3:42 AM, "Jack Tummers" <[hidden email]
>> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>
>>     On the left there is nothing yet, because I haven't added any
>>     people so far.
>>     On the right side I have this (but I don't see how I could add a
>>     people's section):
>>
>>
>>     Op 08-04-13 20:29, Erik Felthauser schreef:
>>>     on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom
>>>     icon on the vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging
>>>     tool. Or, on the right hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th
>>>     icon, then choose the Tags tab, and find or add the people section...
>>>
>>>
>>>     On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]
>>>     <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>>
>>>         Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I
>>>         can see the
>>>         field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under
>>>         preferences, but I
>>>         can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.
>>>
>>>         Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while
>>>         :(.…
>>>
>>>
>>>         Jack
>>>
>>>
>>>         ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>         _______________________________________________
>>>         Digikam-users mailing list
>>>         [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>         https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     _______________________________________________
>>>     Digikam-users mailing list
>>>     [hidden email]  <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>     https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>>
>>     --
>>     Met vriendelijke groet,
>>
>>     *Jack Tummers*
>>
>>     Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
>>     www.jacktummers.nl <http://www.jacktummers.nl>
>>     013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764
>>
>>
>>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>     _______________________________________________
>>     Digikam-users mailing list
>>     [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>     https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Digikam-users mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>
> --
> Met vriendelijke groet,
>
> *Jack Tummers*
>
> Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
> www.jacktummers.nl <http://www.jacktummers.nl>
> 013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Digikam-users mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>

--
Cheers Simon

    Simon Cropper - Open Content Creator

    Free and Open Source Software Workflow Guides
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    Introduction               http://www.fossworkflowguides.com
    GIS Packages           http://www.fossworkflowguides.com/gis
    bash / Python    http://www.fossworkflowguides.com/scripting
_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
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[Simon Cropper-3]

Jack,

*try again, with minor changes*

Your original request centred around the IPTC 'PersonInImage' tag. At
present DigiKam does not allow this IPTC 'PersonInImage'tag to be
changed, although if the value is set using other tools you can see the
value in the metadata section of the right panel.

What Erik is describing is an alternative approach used by many on this
list -- the use of Keyword Tags to flag who is in the picture.

Essentially you can create a Keyword Tag for each unique entity and
check these Keyword Tags if the person is seen in the picture (see
manual on how to create tags). These Keyword Tags can also be easily
used to filter your collection to show, say all photos with your Mum in it.

If you are hung up on using the IPTC 'PersonInImage' tag you may wish to
look at exiv2 on linux or exiftools on Windows/Mac. These
tools/libraries are able to set this value. All you would need to do is
set the value using a script of sorts depending on your operating system.

exiv2 -- http://www.exiv2.org/
exiftools -- http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/

According to exiv2 manpage the value PersonInImage can be set using the
following command (I check this worked on Ubuntu)...

exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mr Periwinkle" image.jpg

You will need to check with the packages you normally use whether this
is going where you/they expect. When I inspect this image in digiKam the
inserted value is in the "IPTC Extension schema" where the standard says
it should be -- as stated although showing the value inserted I can not
edit the data with digiKam.

http://www.exiv2.org/manpage.html
http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptc.html
http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptcExt.html

I hope this helps.


On 16/04/13 09:53, Simon Cropper wrote:

> Jack,
>
> Your original request centred around the IPTC 'PersonInImage'. At
> present DigiKam does not allow this IPTC tag to be changed, although
> if the value is set using other tools you can see the value in the
> metadata section of the right panel.
>
> What Erik is describing is an alternative approach used by many on this
> list -- the use of tags to flag who is in the picture.
>
> Essentially you can create a tag for each unique entity and check these
> tags if the person is seen in the picture (see manual on how to create
> tags). These tags can also be easily used to filter your collection to
> show, say all photos with your Mum in it.
>
> If you are hung up on using the IPTC option you may wish to look at
> exiv2 on linux or exiftools on Windows/Mac. These tools/libraries are
> able to set this value. All you would need to do is set the value using
> a script of sorts depending on your operating system.
>
> exiv2 -- http://www.exiv2.org/
> exiftools -- http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/
>
> According to exiv2 manpage the value PersonInImage can be set using the
> following command (I check this worked on Ubuntu)...
>
> exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mr Periwinkle" image.jpg
>
> You will need to check with the packages you normally use whether this
> is going where you/they expect. When I inspect this image in digiKam the
> inserted value is in the "IPTC Extension schema" where the standard says
> it should be -- as stated although showing the value inserted I can not
> edit the data with digiKam.
>
> http://www.exiv2.org/manpage.html
> http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptc.html
> http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptcExt.html
>
> I hope this helps.
>
> On 12/04/13 18:35, Jack Tummers wrote:
>> Thanks, but I have no idea what you mean :(
>> 'and find or add the people section...' Adding a people's section? How
>> do I do that? And is that exactly the same as the IPTC Extension
>> 'PersonInImage'?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Op 10-04-13 14:52, Erik Felthauser schreef:
>>>
>>> right click, add sub-tag.
>>>
>>> On Apr 10, 2013 3:42 AM, "Jack Tummers" <[hidden email]
>>> <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>>
>>>     On the left there is nothing yet, because I haven't added any
>>>     people so far.
>>>     On the right side I have this (but I don't see how I could add a
>>>     people's section):
>>>
>>>
>>>     Op 08-04-13 20:29, Erik Felthauser schreef:
>>>>     on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom
>>>>     icon on the vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging
>>>>     tool. Or, on the right hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th
>>>>     icon, then choose the Tags tab, and find or add the people
>>>> section...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]
>>>>     <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>         Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I
>>>>         can see the
>>>>         field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under
>>>>         preferences, but I
>>>>         can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.
>>>>
>>>>         Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while
>>>>         :(.…
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>         Jack
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>         _______________________________________________
>>>>         Digikam-users mailing list
>>>>         [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>>         https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     _______________________________________________
>>>>     Digikam-users mailing list
>>>>     [hidden email]  <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>>     https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>>>
>>>     --
>>>     Met vriendelijke groet,
>>>
>>>     *Jack Tummers*
>>>
>>>     Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
>>>     www.jacktummers.nl <http://www.jacktummers.nl>
>>>     013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     _______________________________________________
>>>     Digikam-users mailing list
>>>     [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>
>>>     https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Digikam-users mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>>
>> --
>> Met vriendelijke groet,
>>
>> *Jack Tummers*
>>
>> Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
>> www.jacktummers.nl <http://www.jacktummers.nl>
>> 013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Digikam-users mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users
>>
>
>

--
Cheers Simon

    Simon Cropper - Open Content Creator

    Free and Open Source Software Workflow Guides
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    Introduction               http://www.fossworkflowguides.com
    GIS Packages           http://www.fossworkflowguides.com/gis
    bash / Python    http://www.fossworkflowguides.com/scripting
_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
[hidden email]
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

[Jack Tummers]

Hello Simon,

Thanks for the suggestions and explanation!
I'll use exiv2 for now because my client uses PersonInImage in their image database. But of course I hope Digikam will let me add this tag in the future.

Jack

Op 16-04-13 01:59, Simon Cropper schreef:

Jack,

*try again, with minor changes*

Your original request centred around the IPTC 'PersonInImage' tag. At present DigiKam does not allow this IPTC 'PersonInImage'tag to be changed, although if the value is set using other tools you can see the value in the metadata section of the right panel.

What Erik is describing is an alternative approach used by many on this
list -- the use of Keyword Tags to flag who is in the picture.

Essentially you can create a Keyword Tag for each unique entity and check these Keyword Tags if the person is seen in the picture (see manual on how to create tags). These Keyword Tags can also be easily used to filter your collection to show, say all photos with your Mum in it.

If you are hung up on using the IPTC 'PersonInImage' tag you may wish to look at exiv2 on linux or exiftools on Windows/Mac. These tools/libraries are able to set this value. All you would need to do is set the value using a script of sorts depending on your operating system.

exiv2 -- http://www.exiv2.org/
exiftools -- http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/

According to exiv2 manpage the value PersonInImage can be set using the
following command (I check this worked on Ubuntu)...

exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mr Periwinkle" image.jpg

You will need to check with the packages you normally use whether this is going where you/they expect. When I inspect this image in digiKam the inserted value is in the "IPTC Extension schema" where the standard says it should be -- as stated although showing the value inserted I can not edit the data with digiKam.

http://www.exiv2.org/manpage.html
http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptc.html
http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptcExt.html

I hope this helps.


On 16/04/13 09:53, Simon Cropper wrote:

Jack,

Your original request centred around the IPTC 'PersonInImage'. At
present DigiKam does not allow this IPTC tag to be changed, although
if the value is set using other tools you can see the value in the
metadata section of the right panel.

What Erik is describing is an alternative approach used by many on this
list -- the use of tags to flag who is in the picture.

Essentially you can create a tag for each unique entity and check these
tags if the person is seen in the picture (see manual on how to create
tags). These tags can also be easily used to filter your collection to
show, say all photos with your Mum in it.

If you are hung up on using the IPTC option you may wish to look at
exiv2 on linux or exiftools on Windows/Mac. These tools/libraries are
able to set this value. All you would need to do is set the value using
a script of sorts depending on your operating system.

exiv2 -- http://www.exiv2.org/
exiftools -- http://www.sno.phy.queensu.ca/~phil/exiftool/

According to exiv2 manpage the value PersonInImage can be set using the
following command (I check this worked on Ubuntu)...

exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mr Periwinkle" image.jpg

You will need to check with the packages you normally use whether this
is going where you/they expect. When I inspect this image in digiKam the
inserted value is in the "IPTC Extension schema" where the standard says
it should be -- as stated although showing the value inserted I can not
edit the data with digiKam.

http://www.exiv2.org/manpage.html
http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptc.html
http://www.exiv2.org/tags-xmp-iptcExt.html

I hope this helps.

On 12/04/13 18:35, Jack Tummers wrote:

Thanks, but I have no idea what you mean :(
'and find or add the people section...' Adding a people's section? How
do I do that? And is that exactly the same as the IPTC Extension
'PersonInImage'?




Op 10-04-13 14:52, Erik Felthauser schreef:

right click, add sub-tag.

On Apr 10, 2013 3:42 AM, "Jack Tummers" <[hidden email]
[hidden email]> wrote:

    On the left there is nothing yet, because I haven't added any
    people so far.
    On the right side I have this (but I don't see how I could add a
    people's section):


    Op 08-04-13 20:29, Erik Felthauser schreef:

    on the left hand side of the user interface, click the bottom
    icon on the vertical toolbar for the automatic people tagging
    tool. Or, on the right hand side vertical toolbar, find the 5th
    icon, then choose the Tags tab, and find or add the people
section...


    On Mon, Apr 8, 2013 at 1:22 PM, Jack Tummers <[hidden email]
    [hidden email]> wrote:

        Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I installed the kipi plugins and I
        can see the
        field 'Person Shown' in the metadata window under
        preferences, but I
        can't find it in the metadata window so I can use this field.

        Unless I can find it, I'm forced to use Lightroom for a while
        :(.…


        Jack



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    _______________________________________________
    Digikam-users mailing list
    [hidden email]  [hidden email]
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    --
    Met vriendelijke groet,

    *Jack Tummers*

    Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
    www.jacktummers.nl <http://www.jacktummers.nl>
    013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764



------------------------------------------------------------------------




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_______________________________________________
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--
Met vriendelijke groet,

*Jack Tummers*

Fotografie, websites, ontwerp en idee
www.jacktummers.nl <http://www.jacktummers.nl>
013 467 22 38 / 06 419 20 764


------------------------------------------------------------------------





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[Jean-François Rabasse]

Hello Jack,

I'd like to add a few comments to Simon's post.


On Tue, 16 Apr 2013, Simon Cropper wrote:

> What Erik is describing is an alternative approach used by many
> on this list -- the use of Keyword Tags to flag who is in the
> picture.
>
> Essentially you can create a Keyword Tag for each unique entity
> and check these Keyword Tags if the person is seen in the
> picture (see manual on how to create tags). These Keyword Tags
> can also be easily used to filter your collection to show,
> say all photos with your Mum in it.

Definitely right !
But I think important to add that this is not just an alternative
because Digikam lacks Person in Image edition. Using (structured)
tags is a more natural and efficient way of documenting persons
(and other properties) for several reasons stated below.

And it's not only a Digikam issue, same problem has often been
discussed on Adobe forums and some Lightroom users prefer to use
the Lightroom tags system than the Person in Image field.

The reasons :

1. Tags (in Digikam or Lightroom) have a structured organisation
that allow names aliases without confusion. E.g. you can tag
images showing your friend David with "Persons/Friends/David" (or,
in Lightroom syntax, with "Persons|Friends|David"), and showing
your nephew David with "Persons/Family/David". The name is the
same but it's two different tags, and persons. Person in Image is
a single text field that would allow you to define two times
"David, David".

2. Tags are internal database entities and you can edit the text
label afterwards. Considering Simon's example, it's possible to
tag an image with "Persons/Celebrities/Mr Periwinkle". Some time
later, you wish to edit this tag label because you know the first
name of the guy. It's easy to select the tag, edit properties
(mouse right click on the tag) and replace "Mr Periwinkle" with
"Hieronymus Periwinkle". It takes a few seconds and your hundreds
of tagged images remain Ok.

With a system like Person in Image, you need to re-edit text for
all your already tagged images.

3. (And this is probably the most important reason) Persons
appearing on images are *lists*. You can have from one person (an
artistic portrait) to many (images of a social event, a wedding or
such) on an image.
Tags (Digikam or Lightroom) are implemented in lists,
using the XMP/RDF standard. As IPTC is an older standard,
lists didn't exist and the Person in Image field is a single text
field, not a variable length array. It's possible to define
several persons, using comma separated names, but this is not an
intrinsic and this raises many problems when you want to add or
remove data.

Back to Simon's example :

> exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mr Periwinkle" image.jpg

Definitely correct, and your image metadata contains the proper
data field. But now, if you add someone else :

> exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mrs Dandelion" image.jpg

You've overwritten previous data:-(

Scalar data fields are expected to be set only and have no support
for append or remove operations. Managing lists is thus very
complicated and requires dedicated software: you first need to
read existing text value, break into components using comma or
semicolon separators, add or remove a component, rebuild the full
list with separators and update the data field.

And this has to be done for every image. With tags, you just have
to select target images and add a tag "Persons/Celebrities/Mrs
Dandelion", whatever existing persons tags already exist. Add or
remove are natural operations.

The conclusion :

Especially wrt point 3, above, it sounds that an images
organisation system should probably avoid using things like Person
in Image and prefer organised tags (Digikam:TagsList or
LightRoom:hierarchicalSubject), this for greater flexibility for
now and future.


But, this doesn't solve your initial problem :

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013, Jack Tummers wrote:

> Thanks for the suggestions and explanation! I'll use exiv2 for
> now because my client uses PersonInImage in their image
> database. But of course I hope Digikam will let me add this tag
> in the future.

Of course, if you use applications that expect such or such
metadata field, that field must exist:-)

However, it's probably not the client programs that should master
images collections organisation, but the reverse. Organising
images, defining keywords, tags, documentation, etc., is work done
for a long period of time. Running client software is shorter,
one can use such program, then use another one the next year, etc.

So, perhaps, the reliable strategy is to be able, at a moment,
to translate or convert required data with dedicated small tools,
e.g. a script using command line tools such as exiv2 or exiftool
to extract tags (in Digikam format or Lightroom format) and build
a comma separated list to feed a PersonInImage value to client
programs that look at that.

It's nothing but my opinion...

Regards,
Jean-François

_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
[hidden email]
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[Jack Tummers]

@Jean-François,

This sounds all very reasonable and I agree with you totally.
Perhaps I can convince my client to stop using PersonInImage, for future sake :) That would solve my problem too.

Op 16-04-13 11:13, Jean-François Rabasse schreef:

Hello Jack,

I'd like to add a few comments to Simon's post.


On Tue, 16 Apr 2013, Simon Cropper wrote:

What Erik is describing is an alternative approach used by many
on this list -- the use of Keyword Tags to flag who is in the
picture.

Essentially you can create a Keyword Tag for each unique entity
and check these Keyword Tags if the person is seen in the
picture (see manual on how to create tags). These Keyword Tags
can also be easily used to filter your collection to show,
say all photos with your Mum in it.

Definitely right !
But I think important to add that this is not just an alternative
because Digikam lacks Person in Image edition. Using (structured)
tags is a more natural and efficient way of documenting persons
(and other properties) for several reasons stated below.

And it's not only a Digikam issue, same problem has often been
discussed on Adobe forums and some Lightroom users prefer to use
the Lightroom tags system than the Person in Image field.

The reasons :

1. Tags (in Digikam or Lightroom) have a structured organisation
that allow names aliases without confusion. E.g. you can tag
images showing your friend David with "Persons/Friends/David" (or,
in Lightroom syntax, with "Persons|Friends|David"), and showing
your nephew David with "Persons/Family/David". The name is the
same but it's two different tags, and persons. Person in Image is
a single text field that would allow you to define two times
"David, David".

2. Tags are internal database entities and you can edit the text
label afterwards. Considering Simon's example, it's possible to
tag an image with "Persons/Celebrities/Mr Periwinkle". Some time
later, you wish to edit this tag label because you know the first
name of the guy. It's easy to select the tag, edit properties
(mouse right click on the tag) and replace "Mr Periwinkle" with
"Hieronymus Periwinkle". It takes a few seconds and your hundreds
of tagged images remain Ok.

With a system like Person in Image, you need to re-edit text for
all your already tagged images.

3. (And this is probably the most important reason) Persons
appearing on images are *lists*. You can have from one person (an
artistic portrait) to many (images of a social event, a wedding or
such) on an image.
Tags (Digikam or Lightroom) are implemented in lists,
using the XMP/RDF standard. As IPTC is an older standard,
lists didn't exist and the Person in Image field is a single text
field, not a variable length array. It's possible to define
several persons, using comma separated names, but this is not an
intrinsic and this raises many problems when you want to add or
remove data.

Back to Simon's example :

exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mr Periwinkle" image.jpg

Definitely correct, and your image metadata contains the proper
data field. But now, if you add someone else :

exiv2 -M"add Xmp.iptcExt.PersonInImage Mrs Dandelion" image.jpg

You've overwritten previous data:-(

Scalar data fields are expected to be set only and have no support
for append or remove operations. Managing lists is thus very
complicated and requires dedicated software: you first need to
read existing text value, break into components using comma or
semicolon separators, add or remove a component, rebuild the full
list with separators and update the data field.

And this has to be done for every image. With tags, you just have
to select target images and add a tag "Persons/Celebrities/Mrs
Dandelion", whatever existing persons tags already exist. Add or
remove are natural operations.

The conclusion :

Especially wrt point 3, above, it sounds that an images
organisation system should probably avoid using things like Person
in Image and prefer organised tags (Digikam:TagsList or
LightRoom:hierarchicalSubject), this for greater flexibility for
now and future.


But, this doesn't solve your initial problem :

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013, Jack Tummers wrote:

Thanks for the suggestions and explanation! I'll use exiv2 for
now because my client uses PersonInImage in their image
database. But of course I hope Digikam will let me add this tag
in the future.

Of course, if you use applications that expect such or such
metadata field, that field must exist:-)

However, it's probably not the client programs that should master
images collections organisation, but the reverse. Organising
images, defining keywords, tags, documentation, etc., is work done
for a long period of time. Running client software is shorter,
one can use such program, then use another one the next year, etc.

So, perhaps, the reliable strategy is to be able, at a moment,
to translate or convert required data with dedicated small tools,
e.g. a script using command line tools such as exiv2 or exiftool
to extract tags (in Digikam format or Lightroom format) and build
a comma separated list to feed a PersonInImage value to client
programs that look at that.

It's nothing but my opinion...

Regards,
Jean-François

_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
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https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

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[Jean-François Rabasse]

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013, Jack Tummers wrote:

> @Jean-François,
>
> This sounds all very reasonable and I agree with you totally.
> Perhaps I can convince my client to stop using PersonInImage, for future
> sake :) That would solve my problem too.

Need to add something, I was a bit wrong when I wrote :

> As IPTC is an older standard, lists didn't exist and the Person
> in Image field is a single text field, not a variable length array.

It's true that IPTC did exist before RDF formats, but PersonInImage
isn't part of the IPTC core standard. It has been added as an extension
and is encoded as Embedded IPTC into XMP. It's not in the Adobe IPTC
part of images files but in the XMP part and encoded as a list (rdf:Bag).
So, add/remove operations remain possible for software aware of this.

But the system remains uneasy to manage, compared to structured tags.

And the need for specialised tools to postprocess metadata in order to
suit such or such client program needs (get such or such data here and
write elsewhere) remains too...

Regards,
Jean-François
_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
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[Jack Tummers]

This is a bit off topic, but I find this iptc/xmp very confusing sometimes. In Digikam they both show about the same fields (under 'edit all metadata'), but which one to use? Is one of them enough?
It would be easier if everything could be done through the panel on the right, instead of two places.

Op 16-04-13 12:18, Jean-François Rabasse schreef:

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013, Jack Tummers wrote:

@Jean-François,

This sounds all very reasonable and I agree with you totally.
Perhaps I can convince my client to stop using PersonInImage, for future
sake :) That would solve my problem too.

Need to add something, I was a bit wrong when I wrote :

As IPTC is an older standard, lists didn't exist and the Person
in Image field is a single text field, not a variable length array.

It's true that IPTC did exist before RDF formats, but PersonInImage
isn't part of the IPTC core standard. It has been added as an extension
and is encoded as Embedded IPTC into XMP. It's not in the Adobe IPTC
part of images files but in the XMP part and encoded as a list (rdf:Bag).
So, add/remove operations remain possible for software aware of this.

But the system remains uneasy to manage, compared to structured tags.

And the need for specialised tools to postprocess metadata in order to
suit such or such client program needs (get such or such data here and
write elsewhere) remains too...

Regards,
Jean-François

_______________________________________________
Digikam-users mailing list
[hidden email]
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[Jean-François Rabasse]

On Tue, 16 Apr 2013, Jack Tummers wrote:

> This is a bit off topic, but I find this iptc/xmp very confusing
> sometimes. In Digikam they both show about the same fields
> (under 'edit all metadata'), but which one to use? Is one of
> them enough?

It's confusing for historical reasons. Standards can never be
perfect (nothing of what humans do is perfect:-) and year after
year, new things appear, new needs appear, and new standards are
created, supposed to be *better* than previous ones.

When one looks at a very old metadata action, labelling an image
(call it title, or headline, or comment, whatever), a first
proposal came with the JPEG standard, having a comment section in
files. Later came the Exif standard, rather for more technical
information but coming from Japan. And Japanese people, as all
other Asian people, are not always very happy with the
American/Ascii characters set, so the Exif User comment was
introduced with Unicode support. Later came XMP standard and the
Dublin Core schema. DC decided to feature a title in multilingual
format. This is a great enhancement to share information between
different countries but this is « Yet another title field ».
(In the meantime, between Exif comment and XMP dc:title, we also
had IPTC Headline:-)

It's impossible, when a new standard comes, to remove all previous
existing, due to the millions of existing documents and the
thousands of application software using it.
And that's why we have today many places to store things that
sounds more or less the same.


> It would be easier if everything could be done through the panel
> on the right, instead of two places.

The problem applications developers have to face is first to
select a subset of properties, that's what does the panel on the
right you mention, then to choose *where* to store that.
And there's no solution, it's too user dependent. Making decisions
about where to store such or such data means deciding that things
that looks more or less the same *are* the same. At a moment,
earlier versions of Digikam did store titles in 4 places.
(XMP dc:title, IPTC headline, Exif Usercomment, JPEG comment).

Some users may agree with that, and some other may disagree.
(I personally disagree because I don't consider dc:title,
exif:comment, jpeg:comment, to be the same and I already had data
destroyed in images having different values in these fields.
But it's my problem, not DK problem.)

I still believe the ideal solution is to let management software
choose their editable data subset, choose one and only one place
to save, and let the user manage metadata from outside,
with reorganisation tools (e.g. replicate the dc:title value to
exif:comment, or get my persons tags and (re)build IPTC Person in
Image:-).

And this is out of images collections management programs, because
it relies also on programs that will use that metadata. Metadata
storage are to be used and are expected to support interoperability.

E.g. a program that build web pages with images may use image
title to set a page title (the HTML <title>....</title> markup).
But where to find the image title ? In dc:title,
in iptc:headline ? And if both fields exist, with different values ?

No ideal solution is to be expected, sad but true:-)

Regards,
Jean-François




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