About the exif orientation tag and how digikam handles it

[Pedro Venda-3]

Hi everyone,

I've looked around the archives and googled a fair bit about this
subject/issue but couldn't find any solid answer. So I decided to ask the
guys who know, at the cost of potentially being publicly humiliated with a
bold RTFM :) - hope not.

I've recently bought a digital SLR camera and already I've got about 3GB of
photo albums. I use digikam and picasa to handle my photo albums, but digikam
is a better, more robust and more complete product.

All of my photos have the following exif orientation tags:
* top, left - for landscape shots
* left, bottom - for portrait shots (right hand up)

In digikam 0.9.0-beta1 [1], by checking the Settings -> Configure Digikam ->
Metadata -> "Show images/thumbs rotated according to orientation tag" [2]
box, I hoped to get a thumbnail preview screen similar to picasa's,
with "left, bottom" pictures vertically oriented (that's what the exif
orientation tag is there for). However, it doesn't happen; All pictures show
up as landscape shots [3]. I believe this is a bug, but I may be missing
something.
Even though it wasn't really a solution but more a workaround, I solved this
once by checking the "rotate/flip image" box in the camera import dialog [4],
but now I can't even reproduce it - all imported pictures show up as
landscape shots even with different exif orientation tag.
Another way to solve this was the 'jhead -autorot *.JPG', but that's just like
eliminating the exif orientation tag...

The way I think it should work is by rendering the pictures and thumbnails
oriented according to the exif orientation tag, independently from scanning
or importing the files - like picasa does. (sorry for the comparison)
What do you think about this? Is this a bug or am I interpreting the exif
orientation tag wrongly?

[1]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-01-version.jpg
[2]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-02-configure.jpg
[3]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-03-nonrotated.jpg
[4]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-04-rotated.jpg

Congratulations for a great software and keep up the excelent work!
Best regards,
--

Pedro João Lopes Venda
email: pjvenda at pjvenda org
http://www.pjvenda.org

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[Gilles Caulier-2]

Le Dimanche 10 Septembre 2006 23:42, Pedro Venda a écrit :
> Hi everyone,
>
> I've looked around the archives and googled a fair bit about this
> subject/issue but couldn't find any solid answer. So I decided to ask the
> guys who know, at the cost of potentially being publicly humiliated with a
> bold RTFM :) - hope not.
>
> I've recently bought a digital SLR camera

Witch camera exactly ?

> and already I've got about 3GB of
> photo albums. I use digikam and picasa to handle my photo albums, but
> digikam is a better, more robust and more complete product.
>
> All of my photos have the following exif orientation tags:
> * top, left - for landscape shots
> * left, bottom - for portrait shots (right hand up)
>
> In digikam 0.9.0-beta1 [1], by checking the Settings -> Configure Digikam
> -> Metadata -> "Show images/thumbs rotated according to orientation tag"
> [2] box, I hoped to get a thumbnail preview screen similar to picasa's,
> with "left, bottom" pictures vertically oriented (that's what the exif
> orientation tag is there for). However, it doesn't happen; All pictures
> show up as landscape shots [3]. I believe this is a bug, but I may be
> missing something.

In current implementation from svn (next 0.9.0-beta2 release), there are 3 new
features about auto-rotation based on Exif :

--> ther is a new tool to rebuild the thumbnails database in background.
--> changing 'Show images/thumbs rotated according to orientation tag' option
will ask to user if this new tool need to be started.
--> F5 key will re-build the thumbnails from the current album only.

> Even though it wasn't really a solution but more a workaround, I solved
> this once by checking the "rotate/flip image" box in the camera import
> dialog [4], but now I can't even reproduce it - all imported pictures show
> up as landscape shots even with different exif orientation tag.
> Another way to solve this was the 'jhead -autorot *.JPG', but that's just
> like eliminating the exif orientation tag...

(:=))). Too bad...

>
> The way I think it should work is by rendering the pictures and thumbnails
> oriented according to the exif orientation tag, independently from scanning
> or importing the files - like picasa does. (sorry for the comparison)
> What do you think about this? Is this a bug or am I interpreting the exif
> orientation tag wrongly?

Yes, certainly.

>
> [1]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-01-version.jpg
> [2]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-02-configure.jpg
> [3]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-03-nonrotated.jpg
> [4]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-04-rotated.jpg

Thanks for the sample images. I will investiguate next week.

>
> Congratulations for a great software and keep up the excelent work!

Thanks to support digiKam project !

Gilles Caulier
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[Gilles Caulier-2]

Le Dimanche 10 Septembre 2006 23:42, Pedro Venda a écrit :

> Hi everyone,
>
> I've looked around the archives and googled a fair bit about this
> subject/issue but couldn't find any solid answer. So I decided to ask the
> guys who know, at the cost of potentially being publicly humiliated with a
> bold RTFM :) - hope not.
>
> I've recently bought a digital SLR camera and already I've got about 3GB of
> photo albums. I use digikam and picasa to handle my photo albums, but
> digikam is a better, more robust and more complete product.
>
> All of my photos have the following exif orientation tags:
> * top, left - for landscape shots
> * left, bottom - for portrait shots (right hand up)
>
> In digikam 0.9.0-beta1 [1], by checking the Settings -> Configure Digikam
> -> Metadata -> "Show images/thumbs rotated according to orientation tag"
> [2] box, I hoped to get a thumbnail preview screen similar to picasa's,
> with "left, bottom" pictures vertically oriented (that's what the exif
> orientation tag is there for). However, it doesn't happen; All pictures
> show up as landscape shots [3]. I believe this is a bug, but I may be
> missing something.
> Even though it wasn't really a solution but more a workaround, I solved
> this once by checking the "rotate/flip image" box in the camera import
> dialog [4], but now I can't even reproduce it - all imported pictures show
> up as landscape shots even with different exif orientation tag.
> Another way to solve this was the 'jhead -autorot *.JPG', but that's just
> like eliminating the exif orientation tag...
>
> The way I think it should work is by rendering the pictures and thumbnails
> oriented according to the exif orientation tag, independently from scanning
> or importing the files - like picasa does. (sorry for the comparison)
> What do you think about this? Is this a bug or am I interpreting the exif
> orientation tag wrongly?
>
> [1]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-01-version.jpg
> [2]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-02-configure.jpg
> [3]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-03-nonrotated.jpg
> [4]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-04-rotated.jpg
>
> Congratulations for a great software and keep up the excelent work!
> Best regards,

Look this B.K.O file :

http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=127179

And there is a screenshot about the new Batch Thumbnails generator :

http://bugs.kde.org/attachment.cgi?id=17591&action=view

Gilles
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[Pedro Venda-3]

Hi again,

On Sunday 10 September 2006 22:59, Caulier Gilles wrote:
> > I've recently bought a digital SLR camera
>
> Witch camera exactly ?

Canon EOS 350D (Digital Rebel XT in the US)

> In current implementation from svn (next 0.9.0-beta2 release), there are 3
> new features about auto-rotation based on Exif :
>
> --> ther is a new tool to rebuild the thumbnails database in background.
> --> changing 'Show images/thumbs rotated according to orientation tag'
> option will ask to user if this new tool need to be started.
> --> F5 key will re-build the thumbnails from the current album only.

The thumbnail rebuild feature is be very welcome!

Will this affect the images themselves when we click the thumbnail? I
understand that the thumbnails may have a different treatment because not all
cameras generate them equally, but that shouldn't be for the images... I
guess.

The way it works now, if the thumbnail shows up in the wrong orientation,
clicking on it, shows the image also in the wrong position. It seems that the
program is ignoring the tag all along...

> > Even though it wasn't really a solution but more a workaround, I solved
> > this once by checking the "rotate/flip image" box in the camera import
> > dialog [4], but now I can't even reproduce it - all imported pictures
> > show up as landscape shots even with different exif orientation tag.

It would be hard to verify it right now, but I think that this referred import
was made in digikam 0.8.2 and now I'm using 0.9.0, hence the different
behaviour.

> > Another way to solve this was the 'jhead -autorot *.JPG', but that's just
> > like eliminating the exif orientation tag...
>
> (:=))). Too bad...

hmm, I guess it may not be such a bad idea. I've seen the bug report you
pointed me to...

> > The way I think it should work is by rendering the pictures and
> > thumbnails oriented according to the exif orientation tag, independently
> > from scanning or importing the files - like picasa does. (sorry for the
> > comparison) What do you think about this? Is this a bug or am I
> > interpreting the exif orientation tag wrongly?
>
> Yes, certainly.

err, I didn't understand your reply: certainly what?

> > [1]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-01-version.jpg
> > [2]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-02-configure.jpg
> > [3]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-03-nonrotated.jpg
> > [4]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-04-rotated.jpg
>
> Thanks for the sample images. I will investiguate next week.

no sweat. :)

Cheers,
Pedro Venda.
--

Pedro João Lopes Venda
email: pjvenda at pjvenda org
http://www.pjvenda.org

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[Gilles Caulier-2]

On Sunday 10 September 2006 23:42, Pedro Venda wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> I've looked around the archives and googled a fair bit about this
> subject/issue but couldn't find any solid answer. So I decided to ask the
> guys who know, at the cost of potentially being publicly humiliated with a
> bold RTFM :) - hope not.
>
> I've recently bought a digital SLR camera and already I've got about 3GB of
> photo albums. I use digikam and picasa to handle my photo albums, but
> digikam is a better, more robust and more complete product.
>
> All of my photos have the following exif orientation tags:
> * top, left - for landscape shots
> * left, bottom - for portrait shots (right hand up)
>
> In digikam 0.9.0-beta1 [1], by checking the Settings -> Configure Digikam
> -> Metadata -> "Show images/thumbs rotated according to orientation tag"
> [2] box, I hoped to get a thumbnail preview screen similar to picasa's,
> with "left, bottom" pictures vertically oriented (that's what the exif
> orientation tag is there for). However, it doesn't happen; All pictures
> show up as landscape shots [3]. I believe this is a bug, but I may be
> missing something.
> Even though it wasn't really a solution but more a workaround, I solved
> this once by checking the "rotate/flip image" box in the camera import
> dialog [4], but now I can't even reproduce it - all imported pictures show
> up as landscape shots even with different exif orientation tag.
> Another way to solve this was the 'jhead -autorot *.JPG', but that's just
> like eliminating the exif orientation tag...
>
> The way I think it should work is by rendering the pictures and thumbnails
> oriented according to the exif orientation tag, independently from scanning
> or importing the files - like picasa does. (sorry for the comparison)
> What do you think about this? Is this a bug or am I interpreting the exif
> orientation tag wrongly?
>
> [1]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-01-version.jpg
> [2]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-02-configure.jpg
> [3]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-03-nonrotated.jpg
> [4]: http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/sshot-04-rotated.jpg
>

Pedro,

There are some pictures vertically oriented using the same Exif orientation
tag but without the same thumbs rendering. Or something is wrong in digiKam,
or your thumb database have been broken (0.8.x -> 0.9.0 or konqueror stuff...
look my previous messages for details)

Can you give me some vertically oriented pictures from your Canon camera ? I
will test in my computer...

Gilles

> Congratulations for a great software and keep up the excelent work!
> Best regards,
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[Pedro Venda-3]

Hi Gilles,

> There are some pictures vertically oriented using the same Exif orientation
> tag but without the same thumbs rendering.

Yes, that's what I wanted to show you with the screenshots.

> Or something is wrong in
> digiKam, or your thumb database have been broken (0.8.x -> 0.9.0 or
> konqueror stuff... look my previous messages for details)

I don't use konqueror to preview or view the pictures, so I don't think this
is the problem. Nevertheless, I cleared the .thumbnails directory and
restarted digikam. It regenerated the thumbs again with the wrong
orientation.

> Can you give me some vertically oriented pictures from your Canon camera ?
> I will test in my computer...

sure;

* Vertical orientation:
http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/IMG_766_scaled.JPG

* Horizontal orientation:
http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/IMG_767_scaled.JPG

[pictures were scaled in resolution to save bandwidth, but I can supply the
originals if relevant]

Regards,
--

Pedro João Lopes Venda
email: pjvenda at pjvenda org
http://www.pjvenda.org

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[Pedro Venda-3]

On Monday 11 September 2006 13:56, Gilles Caulier wrote:
> > > Can you give me some vertically oriented pictures from your Canon
> > > camera ? I will test in my computer...
> >
> > sure;
> >

*now with correct links*:

* Vertical orientation:
http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/IMG_0766_scaled.JPG

* Horizontal orientation:
http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/IMG_0767_scaled.JPG

Cheers,
--

Pedro João Lopes Venda
email: pjvenda at pjvenda org
http://www.pjvenda.org

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[Gilles Caulier-2]

On Monday 11 September 2006 15:02, Pedro Venda wrote:

> On Monday 11 September 2006 13:56, Gilles Caulier wrote:
> > > > Can you give me some vertically oriented pictures from your Canon
> > > > camera ? I will test in my computer...
> > >
> > > sure;
>
> *now with correct links*:
>
> * Vertical orientation:
> http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/IMG_0766_scaled.JPG
>
> * Horizontal orientation:
> http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/IMG_0767_scaled.JPG
>
> Cheers,

And my screenshot using current implementation from svn of digiKam and Exiv2
library (witch manage all metadata from pictures)

http://digikam3rdparty.free.fr/Screenshots/exifautorotation.png

No problem here (:=)))...

Gilles
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[Pedro Venda-3]

On Monday 11 September 2006 14:45, Gilles Caulier wrote:

> On Monday 11 September 2006 15:02, Pedro Venda wrote:
> > On Monday 11 September 2006 13:56, Gilles Caulier wrote:
> > > > > Can you give me some vertically oriented pictures from your Canon
> > > > > camera ? I will test in my computer...
> > > >
> > > > sure;
>
> And my screenshot using current implementation from svn of digiKam and
> Exiv2 library (witch manage all metadata from pictures)
>
> http://digikam3rdparty.free.fr/Screenshots/exifautorotation.png
>
> No problem here (:=)))...

oh well, there must be something wrong with my system. perhaps the beta2 will
be ok.

Thanks anyway for the help.

Regards,
--

Pedro João Lopes Venda
email: pjvenda at pjvenda org
http://www.pjvenda.org

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[Gerhard Kulzer]

Am Montag, 11. September 2006 15:45 schrieb Gilles Caulier:

> On Monday 11 September 2006 15:02, Pedro Venda wrote:
> > On Monday 11 September 2006 13:56, Gilles Caulier wrote:
> > > > > Can you give me some vertically oriented pictures from your Canon
> > > > > camera ? I will test in my computer...
> > > >
> > > > sure;
> >
> > *now with correct links*:
> >
> > * Vertical orientation:
> > http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/IMG_0766_scaled.JPG
> >
> > * Horizontal orientation:
> > http://mega.ist.utl.pt/~pjlv/IMG_0767_scaled.JPG
> >
> > Cheers,
>
> And my screenshot using current implementation from svn of digiKam and
> Exiv2 library (witch manage all metadata from pictures)
>
> http://digikam3rdparty.free.fr/Screenshots/exifautorotation.png
>
> No problem here (:=)))...

No problem here either (:=)))
Gerhard
> Gilles
> _______________________________________________
> Digikam-users mailing list
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> https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/digikam-users

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